On the other hand, I wouldn't consider them as a deal breaker, and they would not pass up a good deal with an upper only because it did not have them - the M4 feed ramps. It was in the last few issues of SAR. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. I'd get jams from bullets hitting the back of the upper so I took a small round file and made the M4 ramps in the upper. You have a rifle barrel. Go slow and you'll be done in no time. AR Tech Tip - Checking M4 Ramps for overhang School of the American Rifle 84.8K subscribers Subscribe 2.9K 90K views 2 years ago AR Tech Tip - Checking M4 Ramps for overhang Show more Show more. I'm a machinist in the aerospace industry and lucky enough to have unrestricted access to a really nice machine shop so the modification from rifle to M4 feed ramps is no sweat, I've done it once before a few years back with a .250" carbide cutter in the mill for a friend and it came out looking indistinguishable from a true M4 extension. You cannot paste images directly. A couple of times I ended up with the OK set up from the picture above. Now move move the on deck cartridge forward to the 3/8 of inch position and again note the position of the tip of the bullet in relationship to the barrel extension. So the engineers lowered the feed rampa into the receiver. Founded by Frank Galli in 2000, Snipers Hide has been offering informational videos, podcasts, and other support to its users in one location. However Ive built numerous ar15 and lr308 rifles and pistols. what does it do?? I notice that's a Gibbz (or Gibbz-type) upper. 410 stainless is also harder and more corrosion resistant than conventional 416 stainless found in other commercially available precision barrels. It's best to use rifle/rifle combo or M4/M4. The dimensions are different between the two, so theyd have to change some things to the feed ramps dimensions. The manufacturer said they had sold hundreds of barrels with out problems reported. Not saying a really good gunsmith cant do it, just that theres a bit of an involved process. As suggested, its best to match the upper and barrel extension no worries that way. All this basically means is that the ramps continue from the barrel extension down through the upper receiver tonthe magazine. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. You need to match up barrels to receivers for optimum performance. Using an upper with M4 feed ramps with a barrel that does not have them will lead to feed problems as it creates a ledge/lip that can catch the bullet tip as it tries to feed. The only other time it seems to help is if the mag is feeding the rounds with the bullet slightly angled lower than normal. In most cases the ramps only help during full auto mode while cycling at a high rate. Here you can see an upper with "rifle" feedramps. There is a picture of the various options, hopefully another poster can link them. Thats true overall and good to keep in mind. aaargh.. that's the setup I hate to see. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. I checked what I have now. I'm lookin for a clear definition as to what they are, and what they do to enhance a given rifle's performance? Seems counter intuitive to recommend an M4 cut upper, especially if the barrel Im looking at has the rifle feed ramp (not M4 cut). Feed ramps on barrel extensions are a good example. Don't ever put non M4 ramped barrel on a M4 ramped upper receiver. M4 feed ramps. If it was some flat top + 16" FSB barrel id just swap upper/barrel, but this is a little more challenging to do that with. For use by barrel manufacturers. And that is the important thing! and add them to non-m4 barrels.? M4 barrel to non M4 receiver is fine, but not the other way around. I think you will find that the tip of the bullet clears the M4 cuts in the upper receiver by a wide margin. M4 M-4 Feed Ramp Jam with 55 gr grain Bullets, Solution, Fix, AR15 AR-15 Stuck Cartridge iowaunemployment 21K views 10 years ago Comparing AR15 barrels -Faxon vs. Bear Creek arsenal-. Does NOT include pin You CAN modify a rifle/A2 barrel extension to an M4 style extension, but it isn't always the best way to go unless you just have to do it. One of the AR15 engineers under Gene Stoner pretty much said that the M4 isn't a good platform, especially once the gas port erodes a bit. Do you have an AR barrel or feed ramp tip? I've shot a good deal of rounds through 20" A2's and I realize they run but you are describing issues that the M4 feed ramps alleviate, that would probably be good to reduce on A2's as well. What is the difference between Modern, Performance, and Premium Series Barrels? The barrel blanks available are made from 416 Stainless Steel. Given that most of us dont always have perfect access to truly genuine Mil-Spec, mil-standard parts (those actually used in issued fighting tools), were shopping based on a little part trust and a bigger part knowledge. Avoid Polishing Too Lightly Or Too Roughly instead of mil-spec. Bear Creek Arsenal Barrels - 6.5 Grendel Type 2 Barrel This Gorilla Machining AR-15 16" heavy Black Nitride 6.5 Grendel barrel has a Carbine length gas system with a 1:8 twist. If your mag catch is at Spec height, you should not have a problem with an M4 cut barrel in a rifle receiver. Proper maintenance and lubrication. Related: If you are using a Ar rifle, best green laser sight is good choice for hunting. These Mil-Spec M4 feed ramps are part of the original CNC manufacturing process. Your discussions, feedback and comments are welcome here as long as they are relevant and insightful. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. which is bad combo. I've thought about it myself, and I'd like to see test results if any exist, displaying what reliability effect M4 ramps have on other barrel lengths. /r/ar15 is here for your favorite black gun links, build pics, questions and other tactical or practical information. The angle is going to be key, alot of people attempt to mimic the angle of the barrel feed ramps, this is incorrect. I had seen these pix years ago and dismissed the idea of mix and match. It's best to have M4 ramps on both the upper and barrel. check out the. This gave it a longer point for the magazine to allow the rounds to come out of the magazine and feed into the chamber. By the time you made it work you spent more time, money, and effort than if you just bought a new barrel or upper. Thanks for explaining the feed ramp topic in a couple of different ways. JavaScript is disabled. Barrel Length: 16" Barrel Material: 4150V Chrome Moly Vanadium Steel Barrel Finish: Phosphate Barrel Profile: M4 Chamber: 5.56 NATO Twist Rate: 1 in 7" Extension: M4 Gas System: Carbine-Length Gas Block Type: Low Profile .750" Diameter Upper Receiver: Forged 7075 T6 Aluminum Receiver Style: M4 Flat top with feed ramps Receiver Finish: Hardcoat Anodized -The Barrel MUST be removed from the Upper Receiver in order to use this Kit.-Never cut or polish the aluminum M4 Feed Ramps in your upper receiver! Some gun owners believe that the M4 ramps can help for some of the larger-diameter cartridges in use. M4 ramps help in feeding in for carbine in full auto. 2. Full M4 feed ramps start on the upper and continue onto the barrel extension. 308 m5 using m4 feed ramps, which I belive are for the smaller round like. FN AR-15 5.56X45mm Nato . M4 Feed ramps on barrel extensions are a solid example. I too built a .458 SOCOM carbine . Use this M4 Barrel extention with M4 feedramps. But, as with anything else, this work can go too far. Rifles, Uppers, Lowers, Barrels, and more, [ARCHIVED THREAD] - Rifle vs m4 feed ramps, http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q125/PursuitSS/Postings%20photos/c0d26170b75c3e6f9ea65a7d0862247e.jpg. A couple of times I ended up with the OK set up from the picture above. By my estimates, the tip of the bullet first hits the barrel extension about 1/3 of the way up the respective feed ramp on the barrel extension. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. A4 Complete Upper Receiver - 7075 Forged A4 Flat Top Upper Receiver - M4 Feed Ramps Includes: - Add to Cart. Mil-spec is good for the masses, and if you want the job done it is a great start. However, if youre wanting to rebarrel a non-M4-cut upper with an M4 feed-ramp equipped barrel, or going the other direction: you have a new upper thats been relieved to fit with the M4 ramps, and a non-M4-cut barrel extension, and that wont work! so im thinking I might as well just get the unramp upper. I don't have much to add re: feed ramps, but. This can lead to a rare but odd situation; barrel and receiver mismatch. True, which is why they're not even needed in semi autos. 's blog. Single Action and Double Action Which One Is Better For You? Load a magazine with two or three rounds, lock the bolt group back on your rifle or carbine and insert the magazine. There are several, but Steve and the guys at ADCO in OH are one such option (they use the Dremel method, but they do it right as I have seen several first-hand examples of their work and its performance after the fact). So I'm working on my first build, and I'm a little confused. which is basicallly an m16a1 cut down. ago KrinkyDink2 9 hr. I've seen that pic, it is a good reference. In short, if you have a Dremmel you can do it yourself. My experience with ARs is all A-1s. Ready to drop onto a complete lower receiver. I think you will find that the tip of the bullet clears the M4 cuts in the upper receiver by a wide margin. Here's some info from Randall Rauch aka www.ar15barrels.com, if your barrel extension has M4 ramps you should have an upper receiver also with the ramps. Press J to jump to the feed. He had more to say and added some more engineer and gun designer speak too. Change the angle so that the ramp ends at the exact same point. So there's a lot more going on with rounds bouncing up and down in the mags etc. M4 feed ramps were created during the development of the xM4 carbine for the original Army requirement of a carbine rifle that used the then current M16A2 upper receiver, 14.5" Barrel and had featured a collapsible sliding stock. Im an old vet, now retired and looking to build some ARs as a hobby to keep me doing something that I will enjoy. Shopping with us is absolutely safe - you never have to worry about credit card safety when shopping here Share your latest AR build or photos from the range with #RangeDayFriday for a chance to win a new firearm! Description. "It will last 5k rounds instead of 4k. You can run M4 cut barrels with rifle receivers, but not the other way around as it will create at catch that can hang up the bullets. Thats why AR10s- And Scar heavies exist for. Experts advise on 31 degrees+30 minus-zip. #2. Some suggest taking a grinder to the extension area. Editors Note: This article was originally published in January of 2019. Your email address will not be published. I'd get jams from bullets hitting the back of the upper so I took a small round file and made the M4 ramps in the upper. Another reason is that any commercial receiver and parts makers want to tool up to make upper receivers and barrel extensions, especially when shorter guns are becoming more popular. You can post now and register later. So, I had purchased a 458 upper. I have a non ramped barrel in a ramped upper, feeds fine. Pasted as rich text. Those ramps line up with the barrel, which are cut deeper than on a rifle barrel. Gun smith said , not head spaced properly. Then the manufacturer discontinued the barrel. So, an M4 feed ramp includes the barrel extension and the upper. Having been in military supply, I know that what the mil-spec means: it gets the minimum job done for thousands (millions) of parts/systems. Our 6mm ARC barrel come standard with 1-7.5 Twist, M4 Feed Ramps and gas tube. Hasn't misfed yet, through initial break in up through 1k rounds, and that's mag length ammo. In this episode of Gun Stock Reviews, we look at the difference between M4 Ramps and the old standard ramps of the past. Feed ramps being m4 or. The best case is to have both an upper and barrel that have the feed ramps. They were not intended to be super long range man killers. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Owning Best Ruger SR9c Accessories Can Change Your Life. The rifle receiver, doesn't have ramps on the receiver, they are only cut into the barrel. It is milled out of 6061 T6. So I'm thinking I ought to have M4 ramps in the gun because based on what I've read: Rifle receiver+M4 barrel = "OK" but not ideal. Mind shooting me a link where I can pick on a C marked A1 carry handle for $150? The M-16/M4 are great weapons. It's an interesting question. The parts are interchangeable. I picked up a side charging upper from Sundevil last year. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. Rear side of a CZ-75B pistol barrel showing the (here dirty) feed ramp. "C" stamp and CAGE code available. M16's fed pretty well before the M4 feed ramps were introduced. They are better! They provide a lower, wider, and smoother entry for any round of ammo, whether its necessary or not. Questions on how to install your new BA barrel? Modern Series Barrels. An upper without feed ramps can be used with a barrel that has them as the majority of the ramp is on the barrel extension. I'm planning on replacing my forearm with a Larue 13.5. Edited April 27, 2014 by Mark Gale By This includes M4 feed ramps, barrel nut, front sight tower and sight post, and -28 threads for a muzzle device. So, lets glide down these lines below to erase your misconceptions about them. There are now thousands of upper receivers and ready-to-use barrels that have the cuts of M4 feed ramps. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. And it appears that the bolt is slamming into the top of the bullet. 50 bucks one way or the other on the barrel ain't squat! practical_man Is getting it as part of the upper better? I use it for hunting dogs only. M4 16", SBN, 1:7, 5.56 NATO Barrel Specifications: - Caliber: 5.56 NATO (.223 REM) - Gas Tube: Car Add to Cart. The upper I want to rebarrel is modified for Service Rifle competition so it's not quite as cheap as buying another $89 upper from Aero. The Mission of Cheaper Than Dirt! For this test, I used a Colt upper with M4 feed ramps and a SOCOM heavy 14.5 barrel, just like what is used in the military. Little polish. By using the M4 feed ramps for your firearm, you could pick up an increased percentage of the rounds, and feeding reliability would be improved. Other selections are available for upper, bolt and carrier, charging handle, handguards, flash hiders, and gas blocks. I wont buy a barrel that isnt a wylde 223 556 but Im only now noticing. UPPER RECEIVER: AR-15 Mil-Spec Machined out of 7075-T6 Forged Aluminum, M4 Feed Ramps, Cerakoted Magpul Flat Dark Earth (FDE) Color with Forward Assist and Ejection Port Cover Installed BARREL: 22 inch, 223 Wylde Caliber, 4150 CMV, 1:7 Twist, Heavy Bull Barrel Profile, Straight Fluted, Melonite/Nitride Finish - made for us by Tactical Kinetics HAND Reach in through the ejection port and slide the on deck cartridge about 1/4 inch forward and observe the tip of the bullet in relationship to the barrel extension. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. DSA has fat top, Mueller, non feed ramp uppers for $40. All things being equal and having used both weapons extensively, Id rather have the feed Ramps. Semi autos run slower than full autos. http://www.ar15fornoobs.com/wp-content/uploads/feedramps.jpg. 5. JavaScript is disabled. In general, all you need to understand is that the M4 feed ramps include the barrel extension and upper receiver. The difference between standard feed ramps and M4 ramps is easy to see. Both. Thanks! Notice how the ramp starts on the barrel extension and not in the receiver. Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited. Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. Any body need a anchor for a very small boat? I suggest you get a rifle receiver. May 17, 2008 in The Armorer. Full M4 feed ramps are on both the upper and barrel extension. Damaged Ak front end Barrel in Trunnion with or without sight bases. Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. A feed ramp is a basic feature of many breech loading cartridge firearm designs. Copyright 2016 - 2023 by AdventureFootstep.com. Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. Please be respectful of others. That's an important thing since without the feed ramps, issues can arise when receivers and barrel extensions are mismatched. I guess it depends on what your relationship to the necessary shop activities is. Ar-15 Manufacturers Should Be Avoided: Which Should You Buy? All Rights Reserved. I've seen several places say you just need a 1/8" chainsaw sharpening bit and a Dremel to fix it. This is a big tip, by the way, for pistol-caliber ARs. The M4 ramps, if I am not mistaken, were originally made to help reduce malfunctions on the M4 carbine. M4 Feed ramps on barrel extensions are a solid example. It may not display this or other websites correctly. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Its highly recommended to put any AR-platform firearm together with a matching M4 barrel extension and upper receiver set. VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. I just need a little guidance on this and I'm having trouble getting good results from Google. Does anyone have a follow up that confirms or denies my claim? I've seen uppers with and without anodizing on M4 ramps . it seems to me to be about 50/50 with and without. If you consider this article useful, share it with anyone in need! I replaced the M4 feed ramp barrel with a monolithic feed ramp barrel and no more problems. Lol. They guide the bullet up and into the chamber. They . I cant advise on that one folks. They are also 1/7 twist, 4150 steel, chrome lined, and button rifled like the real deal! I have a 723 build (w/ C7 upper) and a 727 build (A2 upper) that use 14.5" Colt M4 barrels. Since the M4 barrel is one and a half inches shorter than the minimum legal barrel you can install in an AR15, the M4 gas tube will be, of course, smaller. I'd rather not spent the money to get it cut to the specific length I need, FSB installed, etc just to have it immediately not work and have to sort out then or start from square one with a new barrel. M4 feed ramps will extend the barrel extension and the upper receiver. Reliability is the main concern for me when I re-barrel this rifle. Should not be too hard. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Some argue that, factually, its a step to enable a smoother feeding. The leading cause that leads to the development of the M4 feed ramp is the gas pressure from the carbine gas system that is increasing along with a high cyclic rate. I've been thinking about doing sort of an "Early Diemaco C8 carbine" clone build with a C7 style upper receiver.